
Ruling allows refusal of some services to LGBTQ+ customers
Clip: 6/30/2023 | 6m 52sVideo has Closed Captions
Supreme Court ruling allows businesses to refuse some services to LGBTQ+ customers
On a 6-3 ideological split, the Supreme Court sided with an evangelical Christian website designer who does not want to create sites for same-sex weddings, even though a Colorado anti-discrimination law would require her to. The court said the First Amendment protects her from creating sites for things she doesn’t believe in. John Yang discussed the decision with Kate Sosin of The 19th News.
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Ruling allows refusal of some services to LGBTQ+ customers
Clip: 6/30/2023 | 6m 52sVideo has Closed Captions
On a 6-3 ideological split, the Supreme Court sided with an evangelical Christian website designer who does not want to create sites for same-sex weddings, even though a Colorado anti-discrimination law would require her to. The court said the First Amendment protects her from creating sites for things she doesn’t believe in. John Yang discussed the decision with Kate Sosin of The 19th News.
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Learn Moreabout PBS online sponsorshipGEOFF BENNETT: John Yang has more now on the court's ruling in favor of a Web designer who refuses to create Web sites for same-sex couples because of her religious beliefs.
JOHN YANG: Geoff, the justice has sided with her on a 6-3 ideological split, saying that forcing her to make Web sites for something she doesn't believe in would violate her First Amendment rights.
Writing for the majority, Justice Neil Gorsuch said: "The First Amendment protects an individual's right to speak his mind, regardless of whether the government considers his speech sensible and well-intentioned, or deeply misguided and likely to cause anguish or incalculable grief."
Today, the Colorado attorney general said the decision gives businesses free rein to discriminate.
PHIL WEISER (D), Colorado Attorney General: This sweeping opinion promises to destabilize the public marketplace, enabling and encouraging all types of businesses, not just those who make Web sites, to have a First Amendment right to refuse customers because of who they are.
JOHN YANG: President Biden said the decision was disappointing.
Kate Sosin is a reporter at The 19th News, where they cover LGBTQ+ issues.
Kate, from your perspective, what's the significance of today's ruling?
KATE SOSIN, The 19th News: Today's ruling is very significant, in that LGBTQ+ people are going to wake up tomorrow in a country where their government decided that it is a protected speech, First Amendment, to turn them away from businesses because of who they are.
And that is a statement that we have not seen before.
It's that we're changing precedent here.
That said, this ruling is very specific to Lorie Smith and her case, and it does not green-light blanket discrimination against LGBTQ+ people immediately.
JOHN YANG: You're right.
It does narrow this to services that express creative content, expression, but could businesses try to frame their businesses in those terms?
KATE SOSIN: That's what a lot of LGBTQ+ legal experts and advocates are expressing concern over.
This really remains to be seen.
The way that we like to describe it as, it creates a new opening, so it signals that the Supreme Court and lower courts will now entertain this question of whether or not your religious freedom gives you the right to turn away an LGBTQ+ person because of your beliefs.
Theoretically, based on this decision alone, it shouldn't.
However, we have never had a decision where we say that your religious beliefs allow you to turn away LGBTQ+ people.
And so cracking that door open, a lot of people feel like, could be the start of an avalanche.
JOHN YANG: What's the current climate for LGBTQ+ rights?
KATE SOSIN: There are two answers to that question.
The first is the political climate, which I think a lot of us know has been really hard for LGBTQ+ people.
We have seen more than 520 anti-LGBTQ+ bills introduced into state legislatures this year.
And as presidential campaigns ramp up, we know that candidates are campaigning on anti-LGBTQ+ stances.
That said, the country itself, the electorate, is moving toward acceptance of LGBTQ+ people.
GLAAD released a study at the beginning of June that found that 91 percent of Americans who are non-LGBTQ+ support the idea that LGBTQ+ people should not be discriminated against.
So there's this huge disparity between the political climate that we're living in and the lives of everyday people.
JOHN YANG: Before the oral arguments, we talked to Lorie Smith, the Web designer who's at the center of this case.
She told us that she thought the fight for her First Amendment rights was not just for Christian conservatives, but for all artists.
LORIE SMITH, Owner and Founder, 303 Creative: And that right is guaranteed to artists like myself, but also to artists like the LGBT Web site designer and graphic designer, who should not be forced by the government to create messages opposing same-sex marriage.
That right to speak freely is guaranteed to all of us.
JOHN YANG: That said, she had a lot of support, legal support, from some Christian conservative groups.
KATE SOSIN: She did.
And it's important to note that the Alliance Defending Freedom, which is the nation's most powerful anti-LGBTQ+ legal organization, took her case.
We have seen them take a number of anti-LGBTQ+ cases to the Supreme Court and to other courts.
And this is an organization that advocates that LGBTQ+ people are similar to pedophiles.
And it also is an organization that has had past ties to Justice Amy Coney Barrett, who had five paid speaking engagements for ADF.
So the landscape here is changing for us.
What we're seeing is a mainstreaming of an organization that we used to consider an extremist organization that's been labeled a hate group by advocacy groups coming in and advocating something that we have now made the law of the land essentially.
JOHN YANG: A lot of people may be thinking that this was already settled by the Supreme Court, because, five years ago, there was a case from Colorado as well sort of dealing with some of these issues.
What was different between these two cases?
And what happened in that other case?
KATE SOSIN: Yes, that case was similar, in that you had a baker who said that his custom cakes amounted to art and he did not want to make a custom cake for a same-sex couple who wanted to get married.
The difference was that, five years ago, the Supreme Court looked at that case and said, we don't fully want to rule on this issue of religious freedom versus LGBTQ+ protections.
And instead of really engaging with that issue, they ruled very narrowly for the baker and said that the Colorado Civil Rights Division displayed animus toward him because of his religious beliefs.
So it left open the door, at least the possibility, that future lawsuits like this could come.
However, it didn't -- it didn't actually undo anti-discrimination protections in the same way.
So, the court declined to really engage with that issue until today.
JOHN YANG: Kate Sosin from The 19th News, thank you very much.
KATE SOSIN: Thank you so much.
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Learn Moreabout PBS online sponsorshipMajor corporate funding for the PBS News Hour is provided by BDO, BNSF, Consumer Cellular, American Cruise Lines, and Raymond James. Funding for the PBS NewsHour Weekend is provided by...