>> O'Connell: I'M SUE O'CONNELL IN FOR JIM BRAUDE.

TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON," WITH TWITTER IN MELTDOWN MODE, AND MANY WONDERING WHERE TO GO NEXT AFTER THE EXODUS, WE'RE WEIGHING THE PROS AND CONS OF SOME OF THE MANY ALTERNATIVES AND THE FUTURE OF THE SOCIAL MEDIA LANDSCAPE AT LARGE.

THEN, AN INSIDE LOOK AT "SIX," BROADWAY IN BOSTON'S HIT MUSICAL ALL ABOUT KING HENRY THE 8TH's WIVES, AS YOU'VE NEVER SEEN THEM BEFORE.

>> O'Connell: SINCE THE RISE OF SOCIAL MEDIA IN THE EARLY AUGHTS, WE'VE CERTAINLY SEEN PLATFORMS COME AND GO.

REMEMBER MYSPACE?

I OCCASIONALLY THINK AND WONDER HOW MY MYSPACE PAGE IS DOING.

BUT FEW HAVE SEEN THE TYPE OF RAPID UPHEAVAL TWITTER HAS IN RECENT WEEKS, LEADING MANY USERS TO SEEK NEW SOCIAL FRONTIERS.

BUT THE LANDSCAPE IS VAST AND THERE ARE A LOT OF OPTIONS OUT THERE, WITH A LOT OF PROS AND CONS, AND A LOT OF CONFUSION, AS MANY ARE FINDING.

SO JOINING ME TO BREAK IT ALL DOWN IS "WIRED" TECH WRITER, DREW AUSTIN; AND PROFESSOR OF JOURNALISM AT NORTHEASTERN UNIVERSITY, DAN KENNEDY.

WELCOME TO BOTH OF YOU.

DREW, I WANT TO START WITH YOU.

I HAVE BEEN IN LOVE WITH TWITTER, I HAVE BEEN A USER OF TWITTER SINCE 2011.

I FEEL LIKE I HAVE FIGURED OUT HOW TO USE IT EFFECTIVELY.

WHEN MAYOR MENINO ANNOUNCED HE WAS NOT GOING TO SEEK ANOTHER TERM, I THINK MARCH OF 2013, AND I COULD FIGURE OUT BY THE PEOPLE I WAS FOLLOWING WHAT WAS HAPPENED.

AND I SAID EUREKA, I KNOW HOW TO USE TWITTER.

AND NOW I'M JUST SITTING AT HOME SAD LOOKING AT MY PHONE.

WHAT IS THE CURRENT STATE AS OF RIGHT NOW TODAY, WHICH WE KNOW MAY CHANGE IN A MINUTE, OF THE TWITTER SPHERE?

>> WELL, SO I WILL PREFACE IT BY SAYING THAT I FEEL LIKE I'M GOING DOWN WITH THE SHIP.

I HAVEN'T ATTEMPTED TO LEAVE TWITTER.

AND I DON'T REALLY THINK I'M GOING TO UNLESS IT ACTUALLY STOPS EXISTING.

I FEEL LIKE THERE IS A PERCEPTION NOW THAT TWITTER AS A USER'S EXPERIENCE IS GETTING WORSE AND WORSE.

UNDER ELON MUSK.

I DON'T SEE IT FROM A SORT OF PRODUCT PERSPECTIVE?

LIKE I FEEL LIKE THE PLATFORM TO ME SEEMS TO BE WORKING THE SAME WAY IT ALWAYS HAS.

I THINK THE VIBE HAS CHANGED.

LIKE THE WAY PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT TWITTER ON TWITTER IS DIFFERENT.

I ALSO DO THINK THAT IT WAS KIND OF ALREADY GETTING LIKE THAT BEFORE ELON MUSK TOOK OVER.

SO TO ME THE WORST THING NOW IS THAT EVERYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT ELON MUSK ALL THE TIME ON TWITTER.

AND I'M JUST SICK OF HEARING ABOUT HIM.

BUT THERE ARE SOME SIGNS THAT AS A BUSINESS AND PLATFORM IT COULD HAVE SERIOUS ISSUES IN THE NEAR FUTURE.

CURRENTLY I DON'T SEE ANY NOTICEABLE CHANGES BUT I'M SURE THINGS WILL COME.

>> O'Connell: DAN, WE'VE CERTAINLY BEEN THROUGH THE EMERGENCE OF NEW MEDIA EVER O THE YEARS.

I MEAN IT IS NOTHING NEW, IT IS ABOUT SOMETHING COMING AND GOING AND CERTAINLY OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS WE'VE SEEN NEW MEDIA EMERGE AND THEN KIND OF JUST DISAPPEAR OR FIDZ EL OR REALLY, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, CONNECT, LIKE TIKTOK.

I DON'T THINK ANYBODY REALLY WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THAT TIKTOK WAS GOING TO MAKE IT AFTER OTHER SHORT VIDEO CLIP SERVICES DID NOT.

BUT THERE IS SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT SPECTACULAR ABOUT HOW RAPID THIS CHANGEOVER IS.

AM I WRONG ON THAT OR DO YOU AGREE?

>> NO, IT IS PRETTY WILD.

AND I MEAN LET'S KEEP IN MIND THAT TWITTER WAS PRETTY OF THE SMALLEST OF THE SOCIAL PLATFORMS.

SO IN SOME WAYS IT WASN'T ALL THAT IMPORTANT.

BUT IT WAS CERTAINLY A PLACE WHERE ACADEMICS, JOURNALISTS, AND MEDIA PEOPLE REALLY LIKED TO HANG OUT.

I'VE BEEN A HEAVY USER FOR YEARS.

BUT YOU KNOW, THINGS COME AND GO.

I HAVE TO SAY, I SET UP ON MASS TA DONE OH, GOSH, ALMOST A MONTH AGO NOW.

AND I'M GETTING 70 TO 80% OF WHAT I LIKED ABOUT TWITTER AND PRETTY MUCH ZERO PERCENT OF WHAT I DIDN'T LIKE ABOUT TWITTER.

>> O'Connell: SO WHAT IS IT, DAN, BECAUSE I TRIED TO GO ON MASTADON, AND IN MY HEAD, I DIDN'T GET PAST THE REGISTRATION LOG IN PART.

MY HEAD JUST EXPLODED.

WHAT IS IT YOU ARE FINDING ON MASTADON WHICH IS ONE OF THE PLACES PEOPLE ARE FLEEING TOO, THAT WAS ON TWITTER THAT YOU ARE FINDING IS BEING REPLACED THERE?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, THE PROBLEM WITH MASTADON, I MEAN I SUPPOSE THE ADVANTAGE BUT ALSO THE PROBLEM IS THAT IT IS A COMPLETELY DECENTRALIZED SERVICE.

AND YOU HAVE TO START OFF BY JOINING A A PARTICULAR SERVER.

WHICH THEY USE THIS VERY PRECIOUS LANGUAGE, HE THEY CALL IT AN INSTANCE.

AND THAT CAN BE VERY CONFUSING TO PEOPLE.

AND SOME INSTANCES AREN'T LETTING PEOPLE ON RIGHT AWAY.

BUT HONESTLY, ONCE YOU ARE ON, THE EXPERIENCE IS VERY MUCH LIKE TWITTER.

AND YOU CAN FOLLOW PEOPLE WHO WERE ON OTHER INSTANCES AND IT IS GREAT.

I MEAN I'M FOLLOWING BASICALLY THE SAME CORE PEOPLE WHO I WAS FOLLOWING ON TWITTER.

AND THERE IS ALMOST AS MUCH SIGNALS AS THERE WAS ON TWITTER.

AND VIRTUALLY NO NOISE.

>> O'Connell: DREW, I MAID THE LEAP OVER-- I'M STILL ON TWITTER AND WILL DOWN WITH THE SHIP AS WELL BECAUSE I LOVE TWITTER AND I'M ROOTING FOR IT.

BUT I'VE GONE ALSO OVER TO POST NEWS.

WHAT IS THAT WEBSITE ABOUT?

IT SEEMS LIKE IF FACEBOOK AND TWITTER HAD A BABY AND GAVE BIRTH IT WOULD BE THAT WEBSITE.

>> WHICH ONE?

>> O'Connell: THE POST ONE, THE POST NEWS.

>> OH, YEAH, I ACTUALLY HAVEN'T USED THAT.

BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WAS WRITING ABOUT IN THE ARTICLE THAT I WROTE FOR "WIRED" RECENTLY ABOUT THIS IS THAT I THINK THERE IS AN ASSUMPTION AND-- WHAT DAN DESCRIBED ABOUT MASTADON IS INTERESTING, I USED MASTADON YEARS AGO, I HAVEN'T MADE THE LEAP RECENTLY ALTHOUGH I MIGHT CHECK IT OUT AFTER HOW DAN DESCRIBED BECAUSE THAT MADE IT SOUND MORE APPEALING.

BUT I FEEL THERE IS THIS ASSUMPTION WE CAN ALWAYS REPLACE ANY PLATFORM THAT KIND OF DEGRADES AND WHAT I THINK THE HISTORY OF SOCIAL MEDIA EVER O THE LAST 20 YEARS ON THE INTERNET SHOWS US IS THAT SOMETIMES THINGS GO AWAY AND THERE ACTUALLY IS NO REPLACEMENT FOR THEM.

AND YOU JUST KIND OF HAVE TO LIVE WITHOUT THEM OR REPLACE THEM WITH SOMETHING THAT IS NOT REALLY THE SAME.

I'M NOT SAYING THAT MASTADON IS OR ISN'T AN ADEQUATE REPLACEMENT BUT THAT IS KIND OF WHAT I WAS-- THAT IS MY HUNCH AND I FEEL LIKE IT HAS BEEN VALIDATED OVER MY LIFETIME AS AN INTERNET USER.

>> O'Connell: THE THING THAT IS FASCINATING ME ABOUT SOCIAL MEDIA, I USED TO SAY THIS ON FACEBOOK ALL THE TIMES MANY YEARS AGO, THEY WOULD CHANGE SOME THING AND PEOPLE WOULD COMPLAIN, ST A FREE SERVICE.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, YOU CAN LEAVE, THEY ARE TAKING SOMETHING FROM YOU WHICH YOU ARE UNAWARE OF, BUT IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, THEY DON'T CARE.

AND I FIND MYSELF SORT OF IRONICALLY, OR TRAGICALLY, IN THAT SAME SPOT WITH TWITTER WHERE I FEEL LIKE I HAVE INVESTED A LOT OF MY EMOTIONAL AND INTELLECTUAL CAPITAL IN TWITTER AND LIKE AS YOU SAID, I DON'T REALLY WANT TO GO ON AND TALK ABOUT, ANYTHING I TWEET NOW PEOPLE LOOK AT AND SAY THAT IS ABOUT ELON MUSK, ISN'T IT?

AND YOU KNOW WHAT, I CAN GO ALL DAY WITHOUT THINKING ABOUT ELON MUSQ.

I JUST WANT MY TWITTER WITH MY TOWN SQUARE AND MY JOURNALISTS AND ACTIVISTS AND NEWS MAKERS THAT I FOLLOW.

BECAUSE I USE IT AS A NEWS SOURCE.

SO WHERE CAN I GO FOR THAT IF TWITTER IS NOT GOING TO BE THAT FOR ME?

>> WELL, GBH NEWS IS ON MASTADON, SUE.

THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER NEWS% ORGANIZATIONS.

I MEAN IT IS DIFFICULT BECAUSE WE MAY BE SEEING A SPLINTERING.

AND THE NICE THING ABOUT TWITTER WAS THAT THERE WAS JUST ONE GO-TO PLACE.

NOW I'M STILL ON TWITTER.

I HAVE BEEN TRYING OUTPOST NEWS AND YOU KNOW, IT'S OKAY.

I THINK THEY HAVE A WAY TOES GO TECHNOLOGICALLY BUT ALL OF A SUDDEN I'M KEEPING AN EYE ON THREE DIFFERENT THINGS.

PLUS FACEBOOK, PLUS INSTAGRAM, PLUS LINKEDIN SO YEAH, LIFE WAS SIMPLER WHEN ALL I HAD TO DO WAS GO TO TWITTER PRIMARILY FOR NEWS AND CONVERSATION.

AND MAYBE A COUPLE OF OTHER PLATFORMS.

BUT WE MAY BE HEADING INTO A BRAVE NEW WORLD HERE.

>> O'Connell: DO YOU HAVE ANY PREDICTIONS?

I LISTEN TO THE GREAT CARA SWISHER'S PODCAST THIS MORNING ON WITH CARA SWISHER.

AND SHE HAD THE FORMER SECURITY PRIVACY EXECUTIVE FROM TWITTER ON.

AND JUST TALKING ABOUT THINGS TO LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, TWITTER HAS A COPY OF MY LICENSE.

I WAS A BLUE CHECK VERIFIED PERSON.

I TAKE THE ADVICE OF ONE OF OUR LOCAL FORMER LAW ENFORCEMENT PEOPLE ANDREA CABRAL AND I NEVER TYPE ANYTHING I DON'T WANT READ IN AN OPEN COURT.

BUT YOU KNOW ALL MY DM'S ARE THERE WHICH I HAVEN'T MADE MUCH-- PAID MUCH ATTENTION TO.

IS THERE ANYTHING WE SHOULD BE, NOT JUST IN TWITTER BUT IN GENERAL LOOKING AT IN THE SOCIAL MEDIA WORLD FOR SIGNALS THAT THE SHIP MIGHT BE GOING DOWN OR TAKING A TURN THAT WE DON'T WANT TO BE ON BOARD ANY MORE?

>> YEAH, WELL, I MEAN I THINK THE MASSIVE LAYOFFS AND QUITTING THAT WAS CREATED OR INCITED BY ELON MUSK, I THINK THAT IS A BIG RED FLAG.

AND YOU DON'T REALLY KNOW, I HAVE READ A LOT ABOUT THIS AND I'MNOT A SUPERTECHNICAL PERSON BUT I KNOW THAT A LOT OF THE SORT OF RISKS THAT ARE CREATED BY THAT MANY PEOPLE LEAVING AT ONCE ARE THINGS YOU WOULDN'T NECESSARILY SEE YET.

BUT MAYBE LIKE SOME MINOR OVERLOOK CODE THAT LIKE BECOMES A BIG PROK AT SOME POINT.

I MEAN WE'VE SEEN PLENTY OF HACKS EVEN IN THINGS THAT ARE IN THEORY BEING OPERATED WELL.

SO FOR A COMPANY THAT ALREADY HAD SOME ISSUES AND THEN LOST MORE THAN HALF OF ITS EMPLOYEES, I MEAN THERE HAS TO BE SOME MASSIVE EXPOSURES THERE.

WHETHER IT IS PERSONAL DATA OR, EVEN THINGS THAT ELON MUSK IS OPENLY DOING LIKE THE WAY HE SORT OF IS WAGING WAR ON THIS TRADITIONAL NOTION OF THE BLUE CHECK.

HE SEEMS TO BE VERY COMFORTABLE SHUTTING DOWN ACCOUNTS OR REACTIVATING ACCOUNTS THAT WERE SHUT DOWN FOR GOOD REASONS AND I THINK THAT COULD GO FURTHER AS HE FEELS MORE BACKED INTO A CORNER WHICH HE PROBABLY WILL.

>> O'Connell: A LOT OF FOLKS WATCHING AND AREN'T ON TWITTER, DON'T CARE ABOUT TWITTER OR MAYBE HAVE FACEBOOK TO STAY IN TOUCH WITH THEIR GRANDKID, MAYBE HAVE A LINKEDIN ACCOUNT, WHY SHOULD PEOPLE CARE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS ON TWITTER?

>> YOU KNOW, THAT IS A REALLY GOOD QUESTION.

AND AS I SAID, TWITTER IS A SMALL SERVICE BUT IT IS A SERVICE THAT HAS BEEN VERY MEANINGFUL FOR PEOPLE IN THE MEDIA, PEOPLE IN POLITICS, AND EVEN PEOPLE IN ACADEMIA.

AND THAT MAY NOT TAKE IN A HUGE NUMBER OF PEOPLE.

WHICH IS WHY TWITTER IS THE SMALLEST OF THE SOCIAL PLATFORMS.

BUT TO THOSE PEOPLE, IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO THEM.

AND I DON'T KNOW THAT AN ORDINARY PERSON WHO DOESN'T USE TWITTER REALLY HAS TO CARE ABOUT THIS ALL THAT MUCH.

BUT THOSE OF US WHO ARE IN ONE OF THOSE THREE AREAS, AS WELL AS A FEW OTHERS, YEAH, IT IS PRETTY MEANINGFUL.

IT REALLY IS.

>> O'Connell: DAN, JUST AS WE WRAP UP QUICKLY, DO YOU THINK THIS IS GOING TO CHANGE DRAMATICALLY, QUICKLY HOW REPORTERS DO THEIR JOB?

I MEAN I MAY ACTUALLY HAVE TO TALK TO PEOPLE AGAIN?

>> OH, HEAVEN FORBID.

YOU KNOW, IT HAS BEEN A GREAT WAY OF REACHING PEOPLE, EVEN IF YOU ARE NOT JUST TWEETING AT THEM.

YOU CONNECT WITH THEM THROUGH DIRECT MESSAGES AND ALL OF THAT.

AND IT IS NOT GOING TO BE AS EASY, THAT'S FOR SURE.

NOT WITH NOT KNOWING WHAT SERVICE PEOPLE ARE ON, WHERE TO FIND THEM.

IT IS GOING TO BE A REAL CHALLENGE.

>> O'Connell: BOY, WE MIGHT HAVE TO USE TELEPHONES TOO, DREW, WHAT DO YOU THINK?

>> YEAH, I MEAN, MAYBE IT IS TIME FOR THAT.

I THINK THERE IS SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE LOST.

SO IT COULD BE TIME FOR IT TO COME BACK IN A RETRO WAY.

>> O'Connell: I'M BRINGING BACK VOICE MAIL, STAY TUNED.

DREW AUSTIN AND DAN KENNEDY, I WILL SEE YOU SOMEWHERE ON SOME SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORM, THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOININGS.

>> THANK YOU, THANK YOU, SUE.

KING HENRY THE 8TH'S WIVES ARE HITTING THE STAGE AT THE EMERSON COLONIAL WITH A BIG TWIST IN THE ACCLAIMED MUSICAL "SIX," PRESENTED BY BROADWAY IN BOSTON.

GBH'S EXECUTIVE ARTS EDITOR JARED BOWEN HAS A BEHIND-THE-SCENES LOOK, WITH TWO OF THE SHOW'S STARS.

♪ LET ME TELL YOU A STORY.

♪.

>> THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING US TODAY, WE APPRECIATE IT.

>> OF COURSE.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.

>> SO LET ME START WITH YOU, HOW DO YOU DESCRIBE THE SHOW?

>> OH MAN, I WOULD DESCRIBE THIS SHOW AS A POP MUSICAL THAT IS TELLING THE STORIES OF HENRY THE 8th'S SIX WIFES FROM THEIR POINT OF VIEW.

YOU ARE NOT GETTING ANY MALE PERSPECTIVE FROM THIS.

IF IS ALL FROM THE FEMALE PERSPECTIVE AND IT IS KIND OF OUT RAGE USUALLY HILARIOUS, IN SO MANY DIFFERENT WAYS.

I AM HOPING THAT EVERYONE WALKS OUT OF THE THEATER WITH A DIFFERENT MINDSET THAN WHAT THEY CAME IN AS, A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE.

>> LET'S START WITH A LITTLE QUICK HISTORY LESSON.

REMIND PEOPLE ANN BOLEYN AS YOU SEE HER.

>> IF YOU HAVE NEVER HEARD OF ANNE BOLEYN, SHE IS ONE THAT WAS CHANGE NOTED TO CHANGE THE HISTORY OF ENGLAND, THE CHURCH CHANGED AFTER HER, THE FIRST BEHEADED QUEEN.

SHE WAS A TROUBLE MAKER BACK IN HER DAY AND STIRRED UP A LOT THROUGHOUT HISTORY.

AND OUR STORY, THEY KIND OF TAKE THAT NARRATIVE WHERE SHE STILL STIRS THE POT A LITTLE BIT.

>> SORRY, NOT SORRY ABOUT WHAT I SAID.

♪ I'M JUST GOING TO HAVE SOME FUN.

♪ DON'T WORRY, DON'T WORRY.

♪ DON'T LOSE YOUR HEAD.

♪ I DIDN'T MEAN TO HURT ANYONE.

♪.

>> IT REALLY LETS YOU SEE THAT SHE WAS A VICTIM OF HER CIRCUMSTANCES AND OF SOCIETY.

AND IT WASN'T ALL ON HER.

>> AND THE SAME LITTLE HISTORY LESSON OF CATHERINE OF ARAGON.

>> CATHERINE WAS THE FIRST ONE AND REALLY THE ONLY ONE IN MY BRAIN.

>> ALL THE TIME I'VE BEEN BY YOUR SIDE.

♪ I'VE NEVER LOST CONTROL NO MATTER HOW MANY TIMES I KNEW YOU LIED.

♪ THE GOLDEN RULES.

♪ GOT TO KEEP MY COOL.

♪.

>> THERE WOULDN'T BE ACTUALLY ANY OTHER QUEENS IN CATHERINE WOULD HAVE HAD A SON AND BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T, THAT IS THE ONLY REASON THE OTHER QUEENS CAME IN.

SHE WAS PECULIARIED TO HIM FOR 24 YEARS AND SHE WAS A SPANISH WARRIOR, SO SHE CAME OVER AND IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE STRONGEST AND MOST POWERFUL WILF THAT HE ENCOUNTERED.

BECAUSE SHE CHALLENGED HIM.

AND SHE DID NOT LET HIM RUN ALL OVER HER.

>> SO HOW DOES THIS WORK THEN.

WE'VE ALWAYS I THINK THROUGH HISTORY UNDERSTOOD THESE QUEENS IN THE CONTEXT OF THEIR HUSBANDS.

SO HE IS ALWAYS THE FRAMING.

DOES THIS COMPLETELY UPEND THAT.

>> THERE IS NO HEN TREE IN OUR STORY SO SO OFTEN, YOU LOOK AT DIFFERENT TEXTS WRITTEN ABOUT THESE QUEENS, DIFFERENT ARTICLES THAT HAVE COME OUT, DIFFERENT DOCUMENTARIES THAT ARE MADE.

AND OFTEN TIMES IT IS THROUGH THE PERSPECTIVE OF A MAN.

AND YOU GET THAT MALE LENS, THAT MALE PERSPECTIVE.

AND THIS IS OUR TEAM, OUR CHOREOGRAPHER, THE BAND, THE VOICES TELLING THE STORY ARE ALL BY FEMALE PRESENTING PEOPLE.

I THINK THAT JUST CHANGES THE NARRATIVE OF THE STORY.

I THINK IT CHANGES THE OWNERSHIP OF THE STORY, THAT WE HAVEN'T OFTEN GOTTEN THAT PERSPECTIVE ON THE BEAUTIFUL RETELLING THAT YEAH, JUST T SAY DIFFERENT KIND OF OWNERSHIP.

>> ♪ CUZ I DON'T NEED TO KNOW.

♪ NO.

♪.

>> WHAT IS THE SIGNIFICANTS OF THAT OF HAVING A PRIMARILY FEMALE IDENTIFYING THEME DRIVING EVERYTHING?

>> I FEEL LIKE IT HELD THE ROOM TO SUCH A HIGHER STANDARD.

THE ROOM WAS HEALTHY IN A WAY THAT I DON'T THINK THAT A LOT OF ROOMS IN THIS INDUSTRY WHERE YOU GO INTO REHEARSAL SPACES AND THINGS LIKE SOMETIMES, THE SPACE CAN BE UNHEALTHY OR UNWAVERING OR A LOT OF TENSION BECAUSE OF THE DIFFERENT PEOPLE IN THE ROOM.

BUT SOMETHING ABOUT THIS ROOM WHEN WE WALKED IN, IT WAS JUST COMPLETELY HEALTHY.

IT WAS ALL OPEN AND EVERYONE WAS JUST VERY KIND TO EACH OTHER.

IT WAS ANOTHER.

>> I THINK IT WAS ALSO A GREAT LAY THARY ALSO IS IN THE SHOW.

THE SHOW TALKS ABOUT THE COMPETITIVE NATURE THAT WOMEN OFTEN HAVE, THAT WE CAN THROUGHOUT HISTORY, THROUGHOUT SOCIETY PIN WOMEN AGAINST EACH OTHER.

>> CAT FIGHTS.

>> YEAH, THAT THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE, THIS ROOM, THIS STORY REALLY SHOWS US THAT THAT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THE CASE.

>> LET'S TALK ABOUT THE THIS, AGAIN UPENDING PRECONCEPTION.

HOW DOES ENGLISH HISTORY LIVE IN POP MUSIC.

>> THEY'RE GENIUS, IT IS AN INCREDIBLE JOB.

IT IS HISTORICAL BUT IT IS CHEEKY, IT IS USING MODERN REFERENCES TO TALK ABOUT, GIVES US HISTORICAL CONTENT, CONTEXT.

>> ♪ I DIDN'T LOOK LIKE MY PROFILE.

♪ TRICKED YA.

♪ TRUE, THAT I DON'T AGREE.

♪.

>> AND IT IS JUST SO SMART IN THAT WAY, TELLING HISTORICAL STORY BUT USING VERNACULAR THAT WE'RE USED TO, THAT MAKES IT SO ANY MODERN PERSON CAN COME AND UNDERSTAND THIS HISTORY IN A WAY THAT RELATES TO THEM AND IS JUST UNDERSTOOD BY THEM BECAUSE IT IS USING PHRASES AND TERMS THAT YOU DO.

>> AFTER HAVING SPENT SO MUCH TIME IN THESE CHARACTERS DO YOU THINK OF WHAT THE REAL QUEENS WOULD MAKE OF HOW THEIR LEGACIES IS BEING CONSTRUCTED ON THE STAGE?

>> I FEEL LIKE CATHERINE WOULD BE PROUD.

I FEEL LIKE BECAUSE SHE WAS DESCRIBED AS SUCH A STRONG, POWERFUL, STERN WOMAN.

>> YOU THINK THE SAME.

>> I THINK THE SAME TOO BECAUSE ANY TIME WE DO, WE MAKE THEM CHEEKY, WE MAKE THEM SASSY, WE MAKE THEM SILLY, THEY ARE SOFT, THEY ARE HARD, THEY ARE FIERY, THEY ARE-- THEY CAN BE ALL OF THESE THINGS.

AND WHEN I THINK OF HOW ANNE BOLEYN MUST BE LOOKING DOWN AND THINKING ABOUT US, WOMEN EXIST IN MULTITUDE.

SO FAR IN HISTORY WE ONLY HAVE BEEN DEPICTED AS TWO DIMENSIONAL CHARACTERS BUT WE'RE BRINGING THEM TO LIFE AND BREATHING NEW LIFE INTO THEM AND SHOWING THAT THEY HAVE ALL OF THESE DIFFERENT SIDES OF THEM THAT WOMEN DO HAVE.

>> I'M CURIOUS ABOUT THE COSTUMES.

AND I WAS READING THAT SHALL-- .

>> THERE IS SOME CODE IN THERE.

>> OH YES.

>> LET'S SEE, ANNE BOLEYN AND HOWARD WERE REPRESENTED THE BEHEADED COUSINS.

GOLD CHAINS IS ALL I WEAR.

IT IS THE CHAIN SPIKES CHAIN SPIKES AND IT ACTUALLY REPRESENTS A NICE WARRIOR COSTUME.

IT IS A BODY OF ARMOR.

MINE IS VERY HEAVY.

IN REAL LIFE.

IT LOOKS HEAVY BUT IT IS ACTUALLY VERY HEAVY IN REAL LIFE.

♪ YOU MUST THINK THAT I'M CRAZY.

♪ YOU WILL NOT REPLACE MEE BABY.

♪ NO NO NO.

♪ AND THE CROWN IS ACTUALLY REPRESENTING THE CROWN THAT BEYONCE WORE.

SO IT IS VERY REPRESENTATIVE OF BEYONCE AND LIKE THIS GOLDEN STAWTS, THAT CATHERINE HAS.

I MEAN THERE ARE SO MANY OTHER LITTLE THINGS IN THE COSTUMING.

>> TALKING ABOUT WEARING ALL OF THAT WEIGHT AND HOW MUCH YOU ARE DOING IN THIS SHOW, IS THERE A PHYSICAL REGIMEN THAT YOU NEED TO HAVE TO SURVIVE THIS.

>> I STARTED OFF THE PROCESS BECAUSE MY COSTUME IS SO HEAVY, AND NOW THEY START ALL OF THE CATHERINES OFF WITH A WEIGHTED VEST.

I DIDN'T GET THAT LUXURY.

THEY JUST STARTED IT AFTER OUR COMPANY.

AND I ACTUALLY HAD A REGIMEN EVERY DAY OF WAKING UP AT 7 A.M. AND RUNNING ON THE TREADMILL, A PRACTICE THAT BEYONCE DOES AND SINGING THE FIRST 25 MINUTES OF THE SHOW BECAUSE KALT WRITTEN DOESN'T GET A BREAK-- CATHERINE DOESN'T GET A JOB, FROM THE OPENING NUMBER, TO THE OPENING SCENE TO HER SONG.

SHE DOESN'T GET A SECOND TO BREATHE.

>> MINE IS A LOT OF PILL ATES AND STRENGTH TRAINING AND JUST PLENTY OF CARDIO IN THE SHOW.

>> YOU KNOW HOW AUDIENCES HAVE BEEN WITH THIS SHOW.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHY IT IS RESONATING SO MUCH?

>> YES, ESPECIALLY WITH OUR CAST.

WE ARE ONE OF THE ONLY CASTS THAT IS COMPLETELY WOMEN OF COLOR.

AND SO IT IS A BIT MORE, IT GIVES A BIT MORE JOY AND OOMPH UNDERNEATH MY PERFORMANCE BECAUSE I GET TO LOOK OUT INTO THE AUDIENCE AND SEE NOT ONLY EVERY LITTLE GIRL BUT EVERY PERSON IN THIS QUEENDOM, ALL OF THE FANS, THEY GET TO SEE THEMSELVES REPRESENTED IN EVERY SINGLE SHAPE, COLOR, FORM IN THIS SHOW, IN OUR CAST SPECIFICALLY.

MY HEART JUST EXPLODES WITH JOY.

AND LITTLE GIRLS, IT MAKES IT ALL WORTH IT AT THE END OF THE DAY.

>> THE SHOW REALLY PREPARES, AGAIN, YOU DO NOT NEED TO COMPARE YOURSELF, YOU DO NOT NEED TO MAKE YOU FEEL SMALL.

AND THE SHOW.

>> I HAVE A QUOTE IN MY BIO IN THE PLY BILL IS IF THE SUN DOES NOT SHINE-- I VERY MUCH SO LIVE BY THAT, BECAUSE I DON'T ASK PERMISSION TO SHINE, I DON'T EXPECTED ANYONE ELSE TO HAVE PERMISSION TO SHINE STVMENT WHAT YOU SHOULD DO WHEN YOU WAKE UP IN THE MORNING.

>> YOU BOTH FILLED THIS ROOM.

THIS IS SO EXCITING AND FUN, THANK YOU SO MUCH AND CONGRATULATIONS ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU.

>> O'Connell: "SIX" IS SHOWING AT THE EMERSON COLONIAL THEATER THOUGH DECEMBER 31.

FOR TICKETS AND MORE INFORMATION, GO TO emersoncolonialtheater.com THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT, BUT COME BACK TOMORROW FOR "TALKING POLITICS."

ADAM REILLY WILL TALK WITH THE BOSTON CITY COUNCILOR LEADING THE CHARGE TO TRY TO LET 16-YEAR-OLDS VOTE IN LOCAL ELECTIONS.

PLUS, SIZING UP GOVERNOR-ELECT MAURA HEALEY'S TRANSITION PLANS, AND MITT ROMNEY'S EVOLUTION ON SAME SEX MARRIAGE.

THAT AND MORE, TOMORROW AT 7:00.

THANKS FOR WATCHING.

>> I'M DEEP IN THE LYNN WOODS, INSIDE THE BELLY OF THE BEAST, DUNGEON ROCK.

SOME SAY THAT THIS PLACE IS SERIOUSLY HAUNTED.

>> DO YOU WORRY THAT IT'S ACTUALLY HAUNTED?

>> FOR SURE.

YES, ABSOLUTELY.

>> OTHERS, THAT IT HIDES THE TREASURE OF THE 17th CENTURY PIRATE THOMAS VEAL.

>> HE'S IN THE CAVE.

THE TREASURE'S IN THE CAVE AND HE'S SMASHED FLAT.

>> SO THIS ROCK BECOMES HIS DUNGEON.

ONE THING THAT IS CERTAIN: IT WAS DUG BY A MAN WHO BELIEVED HE WAS BEING LED RIGHT HERE FROM BEYOND THE GRAVE.

SO THERE IS A SUPPOSEDLY HAUNTED CAVE HERE IN LYNN.

WE'RE GOING TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS SPOOKY STORY, AND OUR QUEST BEGINS RIGHT HERE.

>> I GREW UP NOT TOO FAR FROM THE WOODS.

WE DEFINITELY LEARNED ABOUT DUNGEON ROCK AS KIDS, FOR SURE.

IT'S A PRETTY COOL AND COMPELLING STORY.

>> IN THE MID-1800's, THE WOODS ENTERED AN OMINOUS CHAPTER, BECOMING A HOTBED OF THE PARANORMAL, THANKS TO A MASSACHUSETTS MAN NAMED HIRAM MARBLE, A MEMBER OF THE SOCIAL RELIGIOUS MOVEMENT CALLED "SPIRITUALISM."

>> THEY HAD MEDIUMS THAT BELIEVED THAT THEY COULD SPEAK TO PEOPLE THAT HAVE PASSED ON.

AND SO HIRAM MARBLE WOULD USE THESE MEDIUMS.

>> MARBLE PURCHASED THE LAND IN LYNN WOODS BECAUSE HE BELIEVED HE WAS BEING LED THERE BY ONE SPIRIT IN PARTICULAR, THE GHOST OF A PIRATE FROM THE 1600's NAMED THOMAS VEAL.

STORIES HAVE IT THAT THERE WAS A PIRATE WHO ENDED UP TAKING UP SHOP THERE, HIDING WITH HIS TREASURE.

AN EARTHQUAKE HAPPENED AND HE WAS SEALED IN THE CAVE WITH THE TREASURE, ALLEGEDLY.

>> THE PIRATE STORY FIRST APPEARED IN PRINT NEARLY TWO CENTURIES AFTER IT SUPPOSEDLY HAPPENED, AND SOON VERSIONS BEGAN POPPING UP ALL OVER.

AND IT WAS AGAINST THIS BACKDROP THAT HIRAM MARBLE AND HIS SON EDWIN WOULD SPEND 30 YEARS RELENTLESSLY DIGGING A CAVE IN SEARCH OF THE REMAINS OF THOMAS VEAL AND HIS BURIED TREASURE.

A CAVE STILL THERE TODAY, DUNGEON ROCK.

WOULD YOU BE INTERESTED IN JOINING ME FOR A LITTLE TRIP TO THE PIRATE CAVE?

>> THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO STILL GO TO DUNGEON ROCK.

I'M JUST NOT ONE OF THEM.

>> WAIT, YOU'VE NEVER BEEN INSIDE?

>> NO.

>> WHY?

>> IT CREEPS ME OUT A LITTLE BIT.

>> DO YOU WORRY THAT IT'S ACTUALLY HAUNTED?

>> YEAH, FOR SURE.

>> FOR SURE?

>> YES, ABSOLUTELY.

I DON'T NEED TO ENCOUNTER THAT SPIRIT.

>> AT THE EDGE OF THE WOODS, TODAY A 2,200-ACRE PARK, WE MET UP WITH RANGER DAN SMALL, OUR GUIDE INTO THE ALERT OF HIRAM MARBLE'S UNHOLY OBSESSION.

THERE WAS NO TURNING BACK NOW.

>> THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO WON'T GO IN.

ONE TIME, OH, 20 YEARS AGO, I HAD AN ASSISTANT RANGER, AND HE WAS A RUGGED GUY.

HE WAS LIKE, A REGULAR GUY.

BUT HE WOULD NOT GO IN THERE.

>> AS THE ORIGINAL STORY GOES, ONE NIGHT IN 1658, A MYSTERIOUS SHIP APPEARED IN THE BAY.

FOUR MEN, INCLUDING THOMAS VEAL, WERE SEEN ROWING FROM IT UP THE SAUGUS RIVER.

THEY TOOK UP RESIDENCY IN THE WOODS.

>> AND HE HAD THE TREASURE WITH HIM, WHICH IS THE IMPORTANT PART.

>> THREE OF THE PIRATES WERE CAPTURED BY AUTHORITIES, BUT THOMAS VEAL ESCAPED.

>> HE RAN UP INTO HERE WITH THE TREASURE.

BEHIND THIS BIG ROCK THAT YOU'RE STANDING NEXT TO, THERE'S ACTUALLY A NATURAL CAVE.

>> AND THERE HE LIVED FOR A TIME, UNTIL A GREAT EARTHQUAKE STRUCK AND COLLAPSED HIS MAKESHIFT ABODE.

THAT'S WHY IT'S CALLED DUNGEON ROCK.

THIS IS THE PIRATE'S DUNGEON, BECAUSE A BIG BOULDER HAS HIM TRAPPED UNDERNEATH IT.

>> AS FOR THE VERACITY OF THIS OLD YARN?

MEH.

>> THERE WERE PIRATES IN THIS AREA AT THAT TIME.

THERE REALLY WAS A GUY NAMED TOM VEAL.

THERE'S RECORDS OF HIM IN THE SALEM COURT.

>> BUT WHILE THERE ARE FIRSTHAND RECORDS OF EARTHQUAKES HERE IN 1638 AND 1663, THERE WASN'T ONE IN 1658.

>> ANOTHER MAJOR FAULT WITH THE STORY, TOO, IS NOWHERE BEFORE ABOUT 1850 OR 1840 IS THERE ANY REFERENCE TO THIS AREA BEING CALLED DUNGEON ROCK.

>> TRUE OR NOT, HIRAM MARBLE WHOLEHEARTEDLY BELIEVED THE TALE.

AS FOR PEOPLE TODAY?

>> I'VE FOUND RITUALLY-KILLED CHICKENS.

I'VE FOUND THINGS WITH CANDLES AND COCONUT, AND ALL SORTS OF THINGS THAT WERE SET UP.

IT'S EASY TO DISMISS IT ALL AS A HOAX OR HOOEY, BUT THE REALITY IS A LOTS OF PEOPLE STILL BELIEVE THAT THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON UP HERE.

AND WHO AM I TO SAY THERE ISN'T?

>> OUT OF EXCUSES AND REASONS TO STALL, IT WAS TIME TO ENTER THIS LITERAL UNDERWORLD.

INSIDE IT IS COLD, IT IS DAMP, AND IT IS DARK.

THE TUNNEL IS ERRATIC.

>> THEY ACTUALLY WOULD HOLD SEANCES IN THE CAVE.

THE GHOST WOULD APPEAR, HE WOULD SAY GO RIGHT, GO LEFT, AND THAT'S WHY IT MAKES THESE ABRUPT CHANGES.

>> AND IT ABRUPTLY ENDS 174 FEET FROM THE START, WITH TWO STAGNANT POOLS OF WATER.

WE GOT A TRUSTY GHOST METER HERE.

IT RUNS ON A 9-VOLT BATTERY.

SO I'M NOT SURE HOW MUCH OF A GHOST METER IT CAN REALLY BE, BUT WE'RE GOING TO TURN IT ON AND SEE WHAT WE FIND HERE AT THE END OF THE CAVE.

ALL RIGHT.

THE NEEDLE SEEMS TO BE DOING ABSOLUTELY NOTHING IN ANY DIRECTION.

A LITTLE BOUNCE HERE.

>> HELLO?

>> WHAT?

HONESTLY, WHAT IN THE (/ BLEEP/ ) WAS THAT?

>> HELLO?

>> HELLO.

>> TURNS OUT IT WAS JUST SOME KIDS MESSING WITH US.

LIKE, THAT WAS LEGITIMATELY, FOR A MOMENT, TERRIFYING.

IN THE END, THERE WERE NO GHOSTS.

THERE WAS NO GOLD.

A DISAPPOINTMENT I THINK THE MARBLES MIGHT RELATE TO.

HIRAM PASSED AWAY IN 1868.

EDWIN KEPT DIGGING UNTIL HIS DEATH IN 1880, AND HE IS BURIED IN AN UNMARKED GRAVE JUST STEPS FROM THE CAVE'S ENTRANCE.

THEY DIDN'T FIND THE TREASURE, EITHER, BUT IN A WAY, THEY DID GET WHAT THEY WERE LOOKING FOR.

>> EDWIN AND HIRAM'S PLAN FROM THE START-- AND THEY MADE THIS VERY PUBLIC-- WAS THAT IF THEY EVER FOUND THE MONEY, THEY WERE GOING TO BUY ALL THIS LAND AROUND HERE, AND THEY WERE GOING TO TURN IT INTO A PARK FOR THE PEOPLE IN LYNN.

>> TODAY IT IS EXACTLY THAT.

AND THEIR MANMADE CAVE AT DUNGEON ROCK IS FREE AND OPEN TO THE PUBLIC WHENEVER THE WEATHER ALLOWS.

SO, YES, YOU CAN COME AND SEE IT FOR YOURSELF.

IF YOU DARE.

>> THE CURIOSITY DESK IS SPONSORED BY EMERSON